Replies to Queries


 and Answers 

Queries about Zionism and Brit-Am Answers.
See also our Separate Articles:
Zionism from a Brit-Am Perspective
The Land of Israel by Yehonatan Davidy.
Brit-Am Replies to Queries: The Land of Israel
Brit-Am Replies to Queries: Returning to the Land
Arabs and Islam
MAP = Movement of Arab Populations
The Jews are Judah
Brit-Am Replies to Queries: Judah
Brit-Am Replies to Queries: Judaism

1. Was the Oslo Agreement Justified?
2. The anti-Zionist Debate and Brit-Am Replies.
(1) Debate with someone who supports the Palestinians.

(2) Question on Israel-Palestinian Conflict, Religion, and US Support.
Yair Davidiy,
Re the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict.
Why must you always try and refer to religion? Because personally i think it just suits you more to portray it as a religious war because obviously it suits to you to try and portray any Palestinian attacks on Israel being based on religion. Basically it sidetracks from the real issues, this is the reason most people in America would support Israel because they believe that Israel is under attack because of their religion.

(3) Brian Patmore: prophecies against Edom applicable to anti-Zionist Palestinians!

(4) David Jackson: Why does America support Israel?

(5) Constance Fischer: Why Americans support Yisrael.
3. Three Basic Attitudes Concerning the Israel-Palestinian Struggle.
4. Answer to Complaint from Pro-Palestinian and not anti-Jewish Liberal.
5. Jews in Arab Lands. How were they really treated?
It is frequently stated that the Arabs treated the Jews well during the Middle Ages
compared to how the Jews were treated in Christian Europe.
Is this true?
6. Where did the term "Palestine" come from?
7. Is Jordan "Palestine"?
8. You have referred to certain Left-Wing supporters of the Palestinians as "Nazi Arab Lovers"!
How can you justify such an extreme description?
9. Your website, Yair says something in respect to removing the Palestinians to other parts of the world.
Is this not ethnic cleansing?
Israel should give up the settlements!
Boycott Israel!
10. Brit-Am Replies to Anti-Zionist Tirade by Left-Wing "Humanist".
11. Yair, a nine-year old Palestinian boy has just been shot by Israeli soldiers.
Look at the video-clip.
Is this what Israel is about?
12. Special Feature: The War of the Word
Selected Edited Minutes from a full-scale no-holds barred debate between Yair Davidiy and a team of anti-Israeli pro-Palestinian pseudo-intellectual fanatics located somewhere in Europe.

1. Question: Was the Oslo Agreement Justified?
Answer: No. The Oslo Agreement and everythin g around it was a disaster for Israel as Brit-Am warned it was liable to be from the very beginning. For a professional opinion concerning this agreement and its effects see the article below, "Ya'alon: We Need Churchills, Not Chamberlains". Brit-Am does not agree withy everything that former Israel Defense Force (IDF) chief of staff Lieutenant-General Moshe Ya'alon says, our own beliefs are somewhat more radical, but his opinion is worth considering.
Ya'alon: We Need Churchills,
Not Chamberlains
[Morton A. Klein is National President of the  Zionist Organization of America.]
A few days ago former Israel Defense Force (IDF) chief of staff Lieutenant-General Moshe Ya'alon laid out an impressive case in an address to the Zionist Organization of America about the perils of a Palestinian state, further concessions to the Palestinian Authority (PA), and the need for Israel to achieve a clear victory against Palestinian terrorism.
Speaking to an overflow crowd at Lincoln Square Synagogue in Manhattan Ya'alon explained from his 37 years' military experience especially his term as chief of staff (2002-2005), during which the IDF greatly reduced Palestinian terrorism   -why he, a  former kibbutznik from the Labor movement who had initially supported the Oslo process, completely changed his mind.
As a senior military figure during  Oslo,Ya'alon said that it became obvious to him by 1995  that Yasar Arafat and the
PA, rather than preparing Palestinian society for peace and reconciliation, were indoctrinating it with murderous hatred
and glorifying jihad and suicide terrorism.
As he puts it, "I needed no sophisticated intelligence to reach this conclusion I only had to look at their textbooks, posters and so on. We should not be surprised, but we ignored it .... In 1999, I was commander of Central Command and I said then that we would face a war with Arafat in 2000. I knew it when Barak said that he would have a settlement with Arafat within 15 months, which meant by September 2000"
Ya'alon believes Israel started to win the war against the PA by methodically cutting down the terrorists and taking the war to them, but then lost many of the gains it had made: He speaks of Operation Defensive Shield in 2002 and especially the clearing out of Jenin as "a very necessary operation." The result was that the terrorist organizations, including Hamas, were on the run. But the announcement in December 2003 that Israel would unilaterally withdraw from Gaza and northern Samaria changed all that. Hamas and others concluded that their terrorist campaign was working, that no concessions had to be made, and that more terrorism would bring about more unilateral withdrawals from Israel.
Ya'alon stressed that the Israeli withdrawal from Gaza was a major factor in the Hamas election victory because it was perceived as a surrender to Islamic terrorism.
"What we are doing is leaving a legacy for the next generation who will deal with Palestinians who believe that terrorism pays, that Israel cuts and runs under pressure," Ya'alon said, adding that Israel is fighting a "war",  not merely dealing with an uprising.
Worse, while lsrael left Gaza saying it would fiercely retaliate against continued terrorism launched from there, it did not follow through on the threat. "After the Gaza withdrawal," said Ya'alon, "I would have recommend after the first Kassam rocket fired into Israel that there should have been a strong and immediate retaliation."
But Israel did not follow this path. Instead, it is following the path of facilitating the creation of a Palestinian state.
"The establishment of a Palestinian state," Ya'alon warned, "will lead, at some stage, to war. Such a war can be dangerous to the State of Israel. The idea that a Palestinian state will achieve stability is disconnected from reality and is dangerous." Israelis, he said, must maintain a military presence in Judea and Samaria as long as the Palestinians refuse to make a serious peace deal, and that "Israel must brand into the Palestinians consciousness" the notion that terror will bring them no benefits.
In line with that, Ya'alon called for a proactive anti-terrorist campaign. "The best defense is a good offense, not a fence. The best way to deal with terrorists is to arrest them or kill them in their beds .... Without dealing with the roots, we can cut down the weeds to deal with the roots would be to force them to reform their education and culture.  I am not  sure we will succeed  but  w e should be under no pressure  to make any concessions until this changes."

Ya'alon emphasized that "The two-state solution failed and to my mind is now irrelevant. In Israel we must consolidate our Jewish Zionist narrative. Without believing in our case, there is no way to convince someone else. Even  before the Hamas victory, a two-state solution was a mistaken fantasy now it's even more irrelevant. The Palestinians knew exactly who Hamas was when they voted for them".
Ya'alon also pointedly stated, "If we couldn't tame and change Arafat, we can't tame and change Hamas. [But] if we're in Judea and Samaria we can thwart the terrorism from there." It is for`this reason that Ya'alon describes Israeli leaders who call for more unilateral concessions "confused" and offering  the Israeli public "illusions."
Ya'alon  concluded  by  saying,"We d on't  need Chamberlains, we need Churchills" who offer realism and warning of "blood, toil, tears and sweat" but also the prospect of ultimate victory.
Ya'alon urged Israel and the West to cease preferring "to be confused" and to instead adopt the "moral clarity to see
that the "from the dawn of Zionism until this day, the source of all terrorist attacks has been the refusal of the Arab world to recognize Israel's existence. Until this changes we will remain the target of violent terrorist activity. The '67 borders are neither a solution to rocket attacks, suicide bombs nor to more conventional forms of warfare .... Iran sees us withdrawing from Gaza, Hamas is elected, they  see U.S. trouble in Iraq and because they do not pay the price for financing, supporting,  and encouraging terrorism, they  continue ....As long as they see our appeasement policy, they will continue."
Israel is proposing to give away 95 percent of Judea and Samaria and declare borders. The US. has already said it will not accept these  borders unless the PA does, and the PA says it won't. Therefore, if lsrael goes through with this huge withdrawal, it will have given away all the leverage it must maintain to resolve issues such as Jerusalem,          refugees, demilitarization, etc. - and will find itself having nothing left to offer.

Source: The Jewish Press Israel Edition, Sivan/June 2006

2. The anti-Zionist Debate and Brit-Am Replies.

(1) Debate with someone who supports the Palestinians.

[The excerpts below have been conflated from several postings.]

i find it remarkable that through trying to make your case you stoop to calling [left-wing pro-Palestinians] 'anti-jewish',or having racism towards jews.
all because some people have the audacity to support
palestinian human rights and self-determination.
we support many peoples' in similar situations etc, to ourselves. it's not so much that the Palestinians are anything so
special,one way or the other.
it's a question of people, nations who are under a state of oppression standing up for themselves.
jews of Russia in the 19th century-as an oppressed community at different times-they like  any other people would surely have an understanding, an empathy with other people elsewhere who'd be in a similar situation....?
just as
irish have had understanding-solidarity, say with the blacks of south africa, as but one example.
if you don't get it all
david [Davidiy], being defensive about this particular subject, and furthermore ignoring the realities of what happened and is happening to the palestinians, gets us all no-where.
i can't understand you.....
why don't you
realise the left support the palestinians..full stop...understand why until then....keep living in cloud cuckoo land....
you know
youve a poor argument,so you base it on race v race situation ,you use the same spiel has other rightwing dogmatists....

ps. the palestinians arent descended from russians , ukrainians, poles, germans, italians, bulgarians....people who follow your religion are.... the palestinians are ...the real descendents....
but you would know that.....

Brit-Am Replies:

Thank you for your messages.
It is obvious that you were concerned enough to write me and to try to correct what you believe to be my misunderstandings.
You claimed that you support "P"s in the same way as you support all "Oppressed" peoples and that the Israeli-Palestinian issue does not receive special treatment. The evidence indicates otherwise.
I went to the Irish Republican URL and put "Palestine" in the Search box and received 276 threads including some by yourself, nearly all of them were against Israel.
How many are there about Sudan, etc.??
Answer: None.
I found at the bottom of postings by yourself plugs for a
"Boycott Israel Campaign".
[Remember the Arab Boycott of Israel?
It saved Israel from remaining a third world country since we had to specialize.
Now the world would suffer more than we would from your proposed "Boycott".]

Many of your claims against Israel are answered in an article I have just written:
"Zionism from a Brit-Am Perspective"
You said that I do not understand, that the left is pro-Palestinian and you are all leftwing and therefore also Pro-Palestinians,
You claim you support the Ps because that is the left-wing thing to do and you are left-wing.
Just because the left wing do it does that automatically make it right?
From what I can see Arab propaganda is funded by religious bigots, oil company monopolists, and medieval-type oppressors of women and children who cut off peoples hands for stealing a loaf of bread.
Is this left-wing?
You said you do not understand me and seem to imply that I do not understand you.
What is there to understand?
Out of all you have said it comes down to three things:
You claim:
a. The Jews are not descended from the ancient dwellers of the land but the Palestinians are.
You call me a "racist" but You are here the ones using a racist argument which is not true but so what?
I could argue with you that The Jews are Judah of the Bible,
also that the basic core of the Jews descend (according to DNA etc) from the Jews who dwelt in the Land two thousand years ago, etc, but what if (for arguments sake) they did not?
What would it matter?
They still remain Jews.
Or it that "racist" arguments suddenly become "kosher" in your eyes when they can be used against Jews?

b. You claim, The Jews dispossessed the Ps.
Again not strictly true.
see my article.
"Zionism from a Brit-Am Perspective"
Even if it was true today there 7 million Jews in Israel. In the world today since WW2 at least 30 million people have been displaced but the only ones you are REALLY concerned about (assuming you are really concerned) are the Ps.
The Palestinians can go elsewhere, the Jews cannot. The Jews have the greater need for the Land and they are the ones in possession. Uprooting the Jews would cause untold sufferings whereas transferring Ps elsewhere could be done quite easily with much much less suffering and perhaps with none at all.
The Ps want to exterminate the Jews as a look at their official and unofficial propaganda will show.
Why do you support them if you do not want to see Jews exterminated?
If you cannot back the Jews because your "left-wing" outlook does not allow you to, why take sides at all?

c. Claims of mistreatment of the Ps.
Sometimes true but often exaggerated and sometimes invented e.g. the alleged killing of 12-year old Mohamed Dura by Israeli firepower was a stage event performed on behalf of French Television as French courts now admit.
Claims of Israel atrocities on the whole are not true or exaggerated but even if they were true their significance when compared to atrocities elsewhere would be marginal.
More often than not because Israeli officials etc are too soft and kindly towards Palestinians, disasters occur.
This of course you never speak of.
One may only conclude that you support the Ps because you are against the Jews as you yourself admit.
If it was anybody else but Jews in "Palestine" (i.e. Israel) you would not worry about it.
Is this an Irish tradition or something?
Please let me know if it is since I am probably of Irish ancestry myself and if anything unsavory pertains to my "kinfolk" I would like to know about it.
Whatever you may say on this matter I do not believe that your opinion represents that of most Irishmen unless the whole country has allowed itself to be mislead by rogues and charlatans.

(2) Question on Israel-Palestinian Conflict, Religion, and US Support.
Yair Davidiy,
Re the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict.
Why must you always try and refer to religion? Because personally i think it just suits you more to portray it as a religious war because obviously it suits to you to try and portray any Palestinian attacks on Israel being based on religion. Basically it sidetracks from the real issues, this is the reason most people in America would support Israel because they believe that Israel is under attack because of their religion.

Brit-Am Answers:
1) You asked, "Why must you always try and refer to religion"?
The verb "try" connotes special effort but if it is true that I do as you say it is something I am not necessarily conscious of trying to do.

2) I am not sure what you mean by "religion". Do you mean that I am aware of the fact that most Israelis are Jewish? By "Jewish" meaning that they belong to the Jewish religion, or descend from those who did, or whose Jewish ancestors did not change their religion?
The Arab-Jewish struggle or Palestinian-Israeli conflict is not between conflicting branches of Islam, is it?
If it was it would not interest most people, would it?
Are you aware that Syria is ruled by the Alawis, a minority semi-pagan Muslim sect, who over the past decades have massacred tens of thousands (if not much more) of Muslim Fundamentalists?
Do you care? I could give several similar examples from the Middle East and numerous more from other parts of the world but let us not weary ourselves with the details we do not really care about, do we?
The Palestinians and Arabs are the ones who portray the Israelis as Jews, preach against Jews, attack Jews outside of Israel, encourage anti-Semitic attacks on Jews all over the world, invent blood-libels against Jews, and subsidize anti-Jewish propaganda.
Do you really think the fact that the Israeli Jews are "Jewish" is irrelevant.
In principle Israeli citizens include Moslems, Druse, and Christians and others, as well as Jews.
The other non-Muslim parties are also often victimized and tormented by their Islamic peers but the emphasis is on the Jews.
I bet that you are not even aware that the Druse and Christian communities in Israel also have grievances against the Muslims and are threatened by them, are you? Would you even care one way or the other?

3) What do you mean by "real issues"?
Do you mean that Israel has taken Land "belonging" to the Palestinians and allegedly mistreats them?
Even if all the lies and malicious slanders daily disseminated about Israel were true (and they are not) it would be nothing compared to other "injustices" committed by others against others all over the world every day. Yet the world hears only about Israel. Why is that?
If you want to ignore that point but still get down to "real issues" i.e. I presume specific grievances of Palestinians against Israelis please read the Israeli side of the story.
Read about Palestinian provocations, propaganda, and terror in Israel and around the world.
Read about the activities of Arab backers of the Palestinians against the State of Israel and against Jews in general. Put yourself in the place of Israelis faced with such a situation.
In specific cases get the details right. What really happened? What was the background?
What do the Israelis say?
What do the Palestinians say about the Israelis in general?
Is it true? Check it out.
What alternatives were there for Israeli behavior in specific instances?
What about Arab conduct?
Do not automatically assume that the Israelis are in the wrong.
Be fair.

4) When engaging in such dialogue with people like yourself or more extreme the fact that the USA supports Israel is often mentioned.
It is given negative implications, as if it is unfortunate and to the detriment of others.
If the USA did not support Israel more Jews might be killed, the state of Israel might be weaker and its very existence could be in jeopardy.  Is such an eventuality desirable in your eyes?
A weaker Israel might let itself be taken over by the Arabs. It might compromise more.
Or it could be that however much it would compromise its situation would just get worse.
[Every time Israel has compromised more Jews have suffered and the position of Israel vis-?-vis the Arabs has worsened.]
Out of desperation Israel might even try to defend itself on a serious scale and a lot of people suffer, and not just Jewish ones.
Would you prefer that?

5) Why does the USA support Israel?
It could be (as some claim) that US support for Israel helps the USA as much as it does Israel.
Nevertheless the USA would not be able to  maintain such a high level of support if the US public did not agree with it.
The US public agrees with support for Israel not out of geo-political and similar considerations but due to some inner identification with Israel.
This could well be religion.
Most US citizens despite Hollywood and materialism etc still believe in the Almighty.
They believe in the Bible, and many of them pray regularly.
In our opinion many of them are descended from Israelites and Jews who lost knowledge of their ancestry.
They are not alone in this matter but apparently forgotten or half-forgotten ancestry needs Biblical knowledge to trigger it off.
Israel is the Land of the Bible and the Jews are the People of the Book and that is why most of the world is against them.
Most of the world is also against the USA and for similar reasons.
In addition to religion, the USA is a warrior nation that likes the odds the Israelis are up against.

(3) Brian Patmore: Prophecies against Edom applicable to anti-Zionist Palestinians!

From: Brian Patmore <manco_yupanqui@bigpond.com>

Shalom Yair,
Responding to the Conflict of Israel and The Palestinians.
Firstly there is no such thing as a Palestinian people !!
 It is a fraud and they have no roots in the land of Israel period.
Look at the prophesies that I have previously referred to:
A. Hashem is clear as to the reason for his anger !!
"For behold, in those days and at that time when I shall reverse the captivity and restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem, I will gather all nations and will bring them down into the Valley of Jehoshaphat, and there will I deal with and execute judgment upon them for their treatment of My people and of My heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations and because they have divided My land." (Joel 3:1-2)
B. Hashem identifies the direct problems facing Israel in these last days.
Obadiah 1:15  For the day of the LORD is near upon all the heathen: as thou hast done, it shall be done unto thee: thy reward shall return upon thine own head.
Obadiah 1:16  For as ye have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.
Obadiah 1:17  But upon mount Zion shall be deliverance, and there shall be holiness; and the house of Jacob shall possess their possessions.
Obadiah 1:18  And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.

It is clearly Esau's descendants the Edomites/Idumeans/Palestinians because of their fanatical hatred of Judah, their close proximity to Judah at this time of the conflict and the identification of one other aspect prophesied, that makes them certain to fulfill the relevant prophesy.
C. They have no clear leadership with the Hamas and Palestinian Authority conflict etc. It is always a matter of turmoil every time they try to appoint leaders. Their kingdom will never be able to be proclaimed unless they ger their act together internally. They sure can get their act together to commit murder on a wholesale basis  however !!
Isaiah 34:12  "They (princes of Edom) shall call its nobles to proclaim the kingdom, but nothing shall be there, and all its princes shall be no more."

Brit-Am Comment:
We do not identify most the Palestinians with Edom but agree that Edomite elements are amongst them and Edomites influence them from outside. In addition, the message expressed by the Prophets against Edom may be applied to all enemies of the Israelite Peoples.

(4) David Jackson: Why does America support Israel?

David Jackson: Why does America support Israel?
Re  (2) above. Question on Israel-Palestinian Conflict, Religion, and US Support
  Re the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict.

Ignoring the belligerent tone of this question, it does raise a fair question: Why does America support Israel?

I think there are several reasons.  First, many Americans were raised in God-fearing churches and spent their Sunday mornings hearing of Moses and Joshua and Samuel and David, finding hope in God's promises to His people and joy in His deliverance.

Many Americans admire nations that have the perseverance to be democratic and live under their elected leaders, as they themselves do, despite pressures that would drive lesser peoples to follow an authoritarian despot.

They admire nations that are displaced into a dry, barren land, and make it into a fertile land, rich in agriculture, industry and education.

When Americans, like decent people everywhere, see a nation attacked by forces who train their woman and children and mentally handicapped to become suicide bombers, they don't need to be told which side represents civilization. 

Perhaps Americans feel that when a nation is savagely provoked and still refrains from using overwhelming power to destroy it enemies, that such a nation isn't being attacked because of its religious values, but in spite of them.

David Jackson
Keller, TX

(5) Constance Fischer: Why Americans support Yisrael

Dear Yair, 
 I believe that there is a three-fold reason why Americans support Yisrael:
1. HaShem is sovereign.  He wields nations like swords and Scripture is clear about that. 
2. Americans support Yisrael because the soul of America, knowingly or not, is Ephrayimite, part of the "other-half" of Yisrael's whole.  We are drawn to Yehudah and stand by Yehudah because we're family. 
3. I also agree that part of this love, respect and support is because His Scripture is woven into the tapestry of America's fabric. 

But ask yourself -why??  Many came to these distant shores to find a place to worship Him in Spirit and in Truth, not to start a new entrepreneurial venture.  His Word was the breath and life and basis of our American constitution because His Torah was in the hearts and minds of this nation's founders. 
The three parts of our government: Judicial branch, Legislative branch, and Executive branch are a clear reflection of Him, His word:
Isa 33:22 for is our Judge (Judicial), is our Lawgiver (Legislative), is our Sovereign (Executive), He saves us!
The men and women who helped found America may not have been davening [praying] in yeshiva, but they were davening in their souls... And so our constitution had an essence and goodness that came from His instruction.
This is the end of days drawing of the coming great reunion and as He "defeathers our nests" here in America, as He draws our hearts ever towards Yerushalayim and Yisrael? there is a lessening of what once made America great because He wants us to turn our hearts towards home.
In His shalom,

3. Three Basic Attitudes Concerning the Israel-Palestinian Struggle.

Three Basic Attitudes Concerning the Israel-Palestinian Struggle.
Not everyone fits into one or other of the categories below.
Most hold their own viewpoints combining elements from two (or even all three) of the Categories listed.
The Three Categories do however enable us to relate more coherently to the subject of Israel and "Palestine".

1. Pro-Palestinian.
In its extreme form this says that Jews are members of the Jewish Religion and not descended from the Ancient Inhabitants of Judah.
This view often claims that Palestinians are descended from Ancient Primary inhabitants of the Land either as Canaanites or actual Jews who lost their religion. The Ps in this view become a kind of alternative "Chosen People" or even a surrogate for the suffering Christian Messiah figure.
Pro-Palestinians say that,
In Modern Times
The Jews came or were sent by Western Imperialist to take the land from the Ps which they did by extortion, by buying it up from absentee landlords, or by simple expropriation. After that they provoked and oppressed the Arabs until a war broke out in the course of, and after which, the Jews forcibly expelled many of the Arabs who became refugees.
Then came a further series of Israeli crimes culminating in wars of conquest and taking the West Bank in 1967.
Ever since then Israel has been oppressing the Ps, stealing their land, illegally building settlements of its own on the west Bank, denying international opinion and behaving as a rogue state under the protection of the USA which backs Israel for Capitalist-Imperialist reasons of its own.
In the above litany of alleged Israel crimes we probably left out a few juicy details but we trust the reader will get the idea anyway.

2. The "Objective" View.
This is largely theoretical since very few actually hold this view but nevertheless it is worth setting forth.
The "Objective" View would say that two very different peoples each have their own claims to the land. These claims are justified in the eyes of the separate parties that hold them. There are pros and cons on both sides.
The Arabs lived in the Land, felt threatened by increased Jewish immigration, war broke out, the Arabs lost, refugees resulted, Israel refused to take the refugees back and the Arabs impeded most efforts to settle them elsewhere. 
Many Jews had come to the Land due to Zionist propaganda along with the anti-Semitic policies and attitudes of the places they had previously dwelt in.
Economic factors in some cases were also important. After 1967 Israel kept much of the land it had conquered, only gave back or lessened its control over part due to internal pressure, and built settlements where it could. The Ps reacted with terror attacks while Islamic backers of the Ps especially in oil rich nations such as Saudia subsidized an international campaign of anti-Israel anti-Jewish propaganda.
These Islamic entities on behalf of the Ps also initiated actual terror attacks against pro-Israel polities as well as using their oil reserves and economic clout to influence other nations against Israel.
The Arabs were able to align most countries of the world on their side due to the Muslim religion, third world sympathies, economic influence, anti-Americanism, anti-Semitism, European prejudice, and the Israelis being considered a "white" western race opposed to a colored one.
Israel had problems of its own, was divided into conciliatory and less-conciliatory elements, but nevertheless developed its economic and military infrastructure becoming in the process (in some respects) a world power.
Israel was greatly assisted by the USA due to a combination of American popular sentiment and geopolitical requirements.

3. The Pro-Israeli View.
God promised the Land to Israel. The Jews are descended from the ancient Israelites to a large degree and those who are not are nevertheless still-citizens of the Jewish polity having equal rights in the Land as all other Jews.
The Jews have more right to the Land than anyone else. They returned to the Land and began to rebuild it. The Arabs attacked them.
The Arabs were stirred up by fanatical medievalist  religious agitators later strengthened by Nazi agents.
Meanwhile the European Nazis and their allies exterminated a good portion of the Jewish Race. This made continued existence for the Jewish People outside of the Land extremely problematic at least as far as a good portion of the Jewish People were concerned.
Nearly all the 100s of thousands of Jews living in Arab States were also largely robbed and in effect expelled meaning for them also that Living in the Land was to a large degree the only real option.
In addition to all this the whole world has changed. The situation is different and Jews who live outside of Israel are in more danger of being assimilated by their hosts than existed previously.
The State of Israel has become an IMPERATIVE for the continued existence of the Jews.
The existence of the State of Israel in the long term is contingent on retaining the West Bank and establishing Jewish settlements there.
Co-existence with the Arabs may no longer be possible mainly due to Arab intransigence.
Nearly the whole world is against the State of Israel but their motivations are very bad ones so the fact that they appear to be the "majority" in this case actually counts against them.
Despite very many bad "eggs", on the whole the Jews relatively speaking are good people and in fact probably too considerate of the other side for their own good.
The best solution for everybody would be for the State of Israel to strengthen itself, show concern for its own citizens, and take steps for the Ps to find an alternative home elsewhere.

We believe that
The Pro-Israeli View
is the correct one.
They who think otherwise should at least clarify to themselves why they think as they do, on what basis can they hold
their anti-Israeli viewpoint.

4. Answer to Complaint from Pro-Palestinian and not anti-Jewish Liberal.

Just because someone sympathizes with the Palestinians does not mean that they hate Jews
or support the killing and maiming of innocent people.
You however sometimes give the opposite impression branding all your opponents on this issue as Jew-haters.
I find such an attitude dishonest and insulting. N.

Brit-Am Reply:
We may over-reacted on occasion to a degree but this is provoked by terrorist attacks around us and earlier over-reactions of  those on the other side.

We accept the fact that many of  those who sympathize with the Ps though holding anti-Israeli viewpoints do not consider themselves hate mongers, or bloodthirsty backers of war criminals, or anti-Jewish. Some of them may even have some sympathy for Jews as individuals and/or as a people. Many of them in some milieus are in fact Jewish by ancestry.

Nevertheless, very often they seem to be unaware of the serious implications involved in this subject and the suffering the side they back intend to inflict on the Jews if it can.
Despite their  "good" intentions this attitude of theirs in a way makes them accessories to those who hold the said opinions and attitudes.
This is also all not so innocuous.
Due to anti-Israeli propaganda anti-Jewish incidents have increased around the world.
Jews in Europe have been physically attacked and harassed.
Even mere verbal insults when gratuitously imparted can be more harmful than one realizes.
This is not a lament.
Just a statement of facts that should be taken into consideration.

5. Jews in Arab Lands. How were they really treated?
It is frequently stated that the Arabs treated the Jews well during the Middle Ages
compared to how the Jews were treated in Christian Europe.
Is this true?

Jews were often treated badly everywhere. It varied from place to place and from time to time.
It depends how such things are to be measured.
Whatever one says must be qualified with numerous exceptions.
On the whole Jews were not treated well by the Arabs. They suffered from persecutions, kidnapping of their women and children, and from deliberate systematic degradations.
The great Jewish Philosopher and Legislator Maimondies is often referred to as an example of how well-off the Jews could be under Muslim Rule.
Maimonides had been raised in Muslim Spain, moved to Muslim North Africa, and then continued to Muslim Egypt where he became the personal physician to Saladin King of Egypt.
Let us hear what Maimonides himself says on the matter:

Excerpt from Maimonides,
"Letter to Yemen"
concerning Mohammed and Islam

##Let Ye understand, my brothers, the Holy One Blessed HE through the trap created by our iniquities cast us amongst this nation, the people of Ishmael [Muslim Arabs] whose oppressiveness is firmly upon us and they connive to do us wrong and despicably downgrade us as the Almighty decreed against us (Deuteronomy 32:31, "Your enemies shall judge you"). There never came against Israel a more antagonistic nation. They oppress us with the most oppressive measures to lessen our number, reduce us, and make us as despicable as they themselves are. King David, may he rest in peace, saw through Divine Inspiration all the calamities that were destined to come upon Israel. Nevertheless [even though he saw all the other troubles], he still began to shout out and lament in the name of the whole nation against the oppression that would be occasioned by the Ishmaelites. David said, "WOE IS ME, THAT I SOJOURN IN MESECH, THAT I DWELL IN THE TENTS OF KEDAR!" [Psalms 120:5].##
##Notice how David emphasizes "
Kedar" out of all the other Children of Ishmael. This is because that Mad Man [Hebrew: "meshuga" i.e. Mahomed] came from Kedar according to what has been published concerning his genealogy.##

Maimonides is referring to the fact that Mohammed was from the Koresh clan of Arabs and they claimed descent from Kedar son of Ishmael (Genesis 25:13).
-Maimonides continues to explain from Daniel 8:10 that Ishmael will ultimately be defeated by Israel.
Source: Maimonides, "Letter to Yemen" 1:4.

Maimonides ("Rambam", 1135-1204). Born in Muslim Spain, he was one of the greatest Jewish legal authorities and religious philosophers. Maimonides served as personal physician to Saladin King of Egypt. He was reported to have been offered a post by Richard-I of England but to have refused it.

6. Where did the term "Palestine" come from?

"Palestine" is derived from the Greek pronunciation of "Philistine".
The "Philistines" were a people who dwelt on the southwest coast of Israel
and were usually antagonistic towards the Israelites.
In 132-135 CE the Jews of Judaea (Judah) under Bar Cochba rebelled against the Romans.
The Romans decided to wipe out all trace of Jewish existence in the Land and so applied the term "Palaestina" to what had formerly been the Province of Judea.
According to Wikipedia ("Definitions of Palestine and Palestinian") the Arabs used the term for a sub-division of Syria and then let it lapse. At the time of the Renassiance the name was revived in Europe in place of the previous cognomen "Holy Land".
After World War-1 with the Balfour Declaration and the British receiving a mandate over the area the name was revived and used officially. Originally the area of "Palestine" included what is now the State of Jordan.


The Original Mandate
of "Palestine"

Note that the area includes that of the present State of Jordan

In 1921 Jordan (then known as Transjordan) was separated by the British from Palestine.
The British bestowed "Palestinian" citizenship on both Jews and non-Jews.
Menachem Begin declared on more than one occasion that he too was a "Palestinian"! After 1948 the term "Palestinian" was applied to the Arab inhabitants of the Land as distinct from the Jewish ones.
Most Arabs in the area had considered themselves as "Arabs" first and "Palestinians" second, if at all.
When I came to Israel in 1974 (after the Yom Kippur War of 1973) if you met an Arab he would say he was an "Arab". The term "Palestinian" was seldom heard on Arab lips.
[I did however come across inhabitants of towns in the Galilee who thought the term "Arab" should not be applied to them but rather only to the Beduin.]
The first Arab who told me he was a "Palestinian" was a high school student who apparently had learnt that he was "Palestinian" in school.
Golda Meir (1898-1978, Prime Minister of Israel  1969-1974) was famous for adamantly insisting that the Palestinian People did not exist.
There is some truth in this. Palestinian national identity is a relatively new phenomenon and was largely created as a counter-balance to Jewish national identity.
The Arabs in Palestine always considered themselves Muslims and Arabs rather than Palestinians.
Their nationalist identity to the degree that they ever had one was firstly as citizens of the Ottoman Empire and perhaps secondly as Syrians or in Gaza perhaps as Egyptians. The most common phenomenon amongst Muslims was that they considered themselves members of the Great Arab Race and this latter self-identification is still the prevailing one.
It should be mentioned that it was common amongst Islamic peoples (such as Turkish groups in Central Asia until very recently) to simply identify as "muslims" placing little importance on inherited ethnicity.

7. Is Jordan "Palestine"?

The League of Nations in 1920 gave the British a Mandate over Palestine whose area included that of present-day Jordan. In 1921-23 the British made "Transjordan" a separate unit.
Jordan After 1948 Jordan ruled over the West Bank but its legality in that area was recognized only by Britain and Pakistan.
##Jordan was the only Arab country to welcome the Palestinians and grant them citizenship (to this day Jordan is the only Arab country where Palestinians as a group can become citizens). King Abdullah considered the Palestinian Arabs and Jordanians one people. By 1950, he annexed the West Bank and forbade the use of the term Palestine in official documents.##

In 1966 Jordan had 600,000 "Palestinians" living in its territory and in 1967 another 300,000 were added.
The population of Jordan is about 5 million not including ca. 1.7 million refugees from Iraq.
In 2002 the king of Jordan claimed that only 40-45% of the citizens of Jordan were Palestinians.
No-one else however seems to agree with him on this matter.
Israeli figures would say that the Palestinian proportion is more than 70% of the total while outside sources at the least agree that Palestinians comprise an absolute majority.
##In general, Palestinian refugees with Jordanian citizenship are treated equally with other Jordanian citizens. Palestinians not only vote in elections, but some hold public office. Five of Jordan's 31 cabinet ministers in 1996 were of Palestinian origin, as were nine of the country's 40 senators. However, these figures under-represent Palestinian numerical strength, which has grown to become an outright majority of the total Jordanian population.##

In summary,
The majority of "Palestinians" are in Jordan.
The majority of "Jordan" citizens are "Palestinians" if we consider "Palestinian"
to be that part of the British Mandate named "Palestine" after 1921-23.
If we consider "Palestine" to be all the original area intended in the Balfour declaration of 1917 and officially confirmed by the British Mandate of 1920 then ALL citizens of Jordan are Palestinians.
The Palestinians have a state.
It is Jordan.
Most of it is in fact "conquered" territory and according to the Bible should belong to Israel but that is another matter.

8. You have referred to certain Left-Wing supporters of the Palestinians as "Nazi Arab Lovers"!
How can you justify such an extreme description?

Left-Wing supporters of the Palestinians are at best gullible dupes of Feudal Oppressors, Slave-traders, Dictatorial Tyrants, Relgious Bigots, and Big Oil Money Magnates.
In other words they support everything the so-called "Left-Wing" pretends to be against.
By "Nazi Arab Lovers" we meant that Palestinians and their Islamic backers in Iran, Saudia,Egypt, and elsewhere intend to exterminate all the Jews in the Land of Israel and as many overseas as they can. This is about the same as the Nazis wanted and partially succeeded in doing.
Even now, in the Land of Israel, in areas under Palestinian control or dominance Jews cannot live.
Very often, they cannot even pass through those areas without risking their lives.
Islamic (and right-wing and left-wing non-Islamic) supporters of the "Palestinians" help carry out terror attacks upon Jews overseas. They also apply terror operations and the threat of them against supporters of the State of Israel.
Anti-Semitic blood libels of the worst king have been revived and new ones invented by supporters of the Palestinians. These activities are similar to those that the Nazis carried out.
The ideological anti-Jewish aspects of present-day Islamic propaganda and outlook also historically owes something to Nazi inspiration. See:
The Nazi Connection to Islamic terrorism
The Nazi Holocaust appears to have kicked into high gear on Nov. 25, 1941, during a Berlin meeting between the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, Haj Amin al-Husseini (1895-1974) and the Nazi Fuhrer of Germany, Adolf Hitler. At that well-documented meeting, Hitler promised al-Husseini, the Palestinian pan-Arab leader, that after securing a dominant military position in Europe, he would send the Wehrmacht, the Nazi war machine, on a blitzkrieg across the Caucasus and into the Arab world under the guise of liberating the Arabs from British occupation.

Overlooked in the history books is the fact that about 100,000 European Muslims fought on the Nazi side in World War II. They included two Bosnian Muslim Waffen SS Divisions, an Albanian Waffen SS Division in Kosovo and Western Macedonia, the Waffengruppe der-SS Krim, formations consisting of Chechen Muslims from Chechnya, and other Muslim formations in Bosnia-Hercegovina.
We should add to the above the fact that in the Middle East numerous Arab activists served the Nazis and praised them in the mosques. The King of Egypt, Farouk, when he thought the Germans were about to conquer his land opened his arms to them and Anwar Sadat (later President of Egypt) was an active German agent who in 1956 wrote a paen of praise to Hitler.
The Nazis believed in a United Europe.
The Beaureucratic heads of the EU who in some ways are the ideological inheritors of Nazism and against the State of Israel have been working for a union of Islam and Europe.
Daniel and the Awesome Statue of Different Substances
We Were Warned! "Eurabia" in The Book of DANIEL?

"Nazi Arab Lovers" (meaning supporters of the "Palestinians" against the Jews) is therefore not an exaggerated expression.

9. Your website, Yair says something in respect to removing the Palestinians to other parts of the world.
Is this not ethnic cleansing? Israel should give up the settlements. Boycott Israel!

I do not like the term "ethnic cleansing" used indiscriminately.
Supporters of the Palestinians use this term and claim Israel is practicing it.
The fact however is that the Palestinian goal is nothing less than the "ethnic cleansing" of all the Jews in the Land of Israel.
They already practice "ethnic cleansing" of all the Jews in every spot under their control and also in many areas overseas.
It is very difficult for Jews to live now in France mainly because of Muslim supporters of the Palestinians and the climate created by people like yourself.
That is also "ethnic cleansing".
If and when conditions become too intolerable for the Jews in France where do you want them to go, if not to Israel?
At the end of one of your post you have the slogan:
"Boycot Israel"!
So that further concessions should be given to the Ps to further them along their road to an attempted "ethnic cleansing" of Js from the land beyond that which the Ps have already succeeded in doing in every area under their control or even only partial influence?
Did you not say that Israel should give up the settlements?
Is that not "ethnic cleansing" of Js from Judah and Samaria?
Please explain the difference.
Was not the forced "evacuation" (due partly to international pressure) of 10,000 Jews from Gush Katif also "ethnic cleansing"??

Is not  a "transfer" of an ethnic entity from one place to another "ethnic cleansing"?
If such is the case why should the Arabs not be helped to move to climes more amenable?

10. Brit-Am Replies to Anti-Zionist Tirade by Left-Wing "Humanist".

There are an estimated 7.1 million Palestinian refugees world wide.
One in three refugees world wide are Palistinian.
The Zionist are guilty of  attacks on civilians, numerous war crimes, and the ethnic dispossession and elimination of Palestinians.
There are over 700 Palestinian children arrested, interrogated and often abused each year by the Israeli forces.
Israel is the only state to commit extra-judicial executions a crime that is considered a form of summary execution without trial.Illeagle under the 4th Geneva convention.
Israel builds illegal settlements,expropriates land, deports people, restricts freedom of movement, harms the economy and makes the Palestinians unemployed and poverty stricken. All this is illegal under the 4th Geneva convention.
In the Gaza strip, the largest outdoor prison, 1.5 million Palestinians are denied their basic needs of food, water and medical equipment.
As a result many have died from starvation and disease.
Since 2002 the apartheid wall has been in construction and declared illegal by the International Court of Justice yet this is ignored by the Israeli Zionist government and its construction still continues to this day.
How anyone can support these Zionist policies is beyond me.

Brit-Am Replies:
I do not know where your figures come from.
Anyway there are now very few real Palestinian refugees unless you want to say
that historically they were or their parents were. In such a case one could also say that every Jew whose parents came from non-Insular Europe or from a Muslim country is also a refugee. You could even say that many of the citizens of Australia and America are still refugees.
In your description of Zionist "crimes" I assume you were referring to what happened between Jews and Arabs in the Wars of Israel against the Arabs.  You are wrong.
Nevertheless, Excesses may have happened.
-But not to the degree that you imagine them to have done so.
More "excesses" happened on the Arab side and still more were intended
and publicly announced as planned or written out in official directives etc.
I doubt however that the ins and outs of these matters really interest you.
In a way maybe you have a point in not taking an objective view of what happened and not considering both sides of the story.

What really interests all of us most could well be the question as to who is in the right in principle.
Do the Jews have a right to the Land?
Do the Jews have a right to live in the Land of Israel?
Do Jews have at least the normal rights accruing to every other human being?
Should Arabs do everything they can to keep Jews out and kill as many Jews as possible?
These are the basic questions.

You complained about Israel "dispossessing" Arabs.
Israel should be trying to persuade the Arabs to go elsewhere and help them do so. Unfortunately its efforts in this direction are not satisfactory.
There are not as many Palestinian refugees as you claim. Most of those Palestinians or children of Palestinians that still are classified as refugees are mainly the victims of Arab regimes that wished to use them against the Jews.
-And, believe me, in Arab minds it is more a question of "Jew" than "Israeli".

You said:
"There are over 700 Palestinian children arrested, interrogated and often abused each year by the Israeli forces...."
I do not know where you got the figure from and doubt your statements.
Nevertheless it should be borne in mind that Palestinian propaganda encourages little children to become martyrs. This may be seen on daily TV programs and Arab radio stations. It is not something one has to "seek out" but rather a fact that is thrown in our faces.
The Palestinians use little children for terror attacks and to throw stones and boulders at Jews while shouting "Kill the Jews!" and "God is Great!"
I have had stones and slingshot projectiles hurled at my humble being many a time and so has the mother of my children and my children and many of the people I know.
[Incidentally I am not a "settler" in your sense but rather closer to Ultra-Orthodox and I live in Jerusalem.]
 In Jerusalem itself Arab children and youths have thrown stones at me.
If you do not believe me come to Israel as a tourist, buy a yarmulke, and walk around the outskirts of East Jerusalem.
Do not say anything. Do not be provocative. Do not even make eye contact.
Just see what happens.
Stones and rocks kill and injure.
What do you think the alternative is?
I suppose you think the Israelis should not react to these actions but simply pack up and leave?
Where do you want them to go to?
What if they cannot leave?
Should they let themselves and their families be stoned to death by Arab children?
If someone was throwing stones and boulders at your children with intend to kill and/or maim how would you react?

You said:
"Israel is the only state to commit extra-judicial executions a crime that is considered a form of summary execution without trial, illegal under the 4th Geneva convention."

Israel executes terrorists who kill Jews or Druze or Israeli Arabs.
Is killing Jews permitted under the Geneva convention?
As for the economic damage done to the Palestinians I was here when things were much better (but not as good as they could have been) and that was when it was possible to give the Arabs employment and trade with them.

You said:
"In the Gaza strip the largest outdoor prison 1.5 million Palestinians are denied there basic needs of food, water and medical equipment. As a result many have died from starvation and disease."

You should read news reports.
Do not read Zionist propaganda if you do not want to but read the regular media.
This media is very prejudiced against the Israelis and frequently gives false reports against Israel.
Nevertheless if you follow it for a while you may come to understand that Israel is not responsible for the situation in Gaza.
Maybe you are?
You and people like you are leading the Palestinians to believe that they will gain by what they are doing and that what they are doing is right.
The Palestinian leadership often seems interested in seeing their own people suffer.
Moving the Arabs elsewhere in a humane manner and helping them readjust afterwards could be a solution.
Would that not solve the problem and end the suffering you so graphically describe?
Could it be however that you prefer the Palestinians suffering as long as through their agony the "Zionist Cause" and "Zionists" may be injured?

11. Yair, a nine-year old Palestinian boy has just been shot by Israeli soldiers.
Look at the video-clip.
Is this what Israel is about?

The Video Clip: AlJazeeraEnglish
deals with an incident reported on 29 July, 2008.
Boy killed in West Bank protest
The clip is short.
We suggest that you look at the clip twice over.
Look at it once while paying close attention to the narrative and the next time with more emphasis on viewing.
Nilin Demonstrator We are told that foreign "activists" are assisting the Palestinians.
We then see an energetic young (apparently foreign) female struggling with a male and being cast to the ground.  The male is dressed in civilian clothes and appears to be an Arab.
What the struggle was about is not clear but it makes good footage.
A 9-year old boy, Hamad Mussa, has been hit.
He has been shot by live ammunition which in the circumstances is forbidden.
The Army promises to investigate.
"Not the first child to be killed" the narratoress informs us..
We see that the incident is connected by the struggle of the village of Nilin against the building of the "Wall" and an access tunnel to land they seek to work on.
At the end we see an Arab youth from a height behind trees fire a sling shot at what are supposedly Israeli forces below.
A promise is gallantly made that the fight will continue.
"The villages will fight on and pray that they will not lose more children as well as their land",
Narrator:  Jackie Morgan, "Al Jazeera", in the West Bank.
The narration is given with emotion.

From the Israeli side:
Video Clips of Israeli victims of Palestinian terror could also be shown.

From the anti-Jihad Palestinian side (there really is one!) it could also be pointed out that:
Quite a few Palestinian children and other "innocents" have  also been the victims of Palestinian gunfire at wedding celebrations or at attempts to construct explosive devices that went off prematurely.

Remember Mohamed Dura? The 10-year old Arab boy who was filmed cringing up against his father while allegedly "Israeli" bullets shot him.
All the world was outraged.
A friend of mine, a Canadian journalist and former contributor to Brit-Am wrote me an indignant and insulting letter because of the incident.
It has now been shown in a French court that the whole thing was staged.
Mohamed was apparently alive after the incident but what happened to him?
Did the Ps kill him to eliminate potential embarrassment?
Or is he still around?
Look at the clips below:

Palestinians Fake Violence to Trick Media

Dura - What Really Happened?

Compare the above with this French Version (Note the title)
"Unarmed Palestinian father & son brutally killed by Jews"

Getting back to the latest incident.
Why bring little children to violent confrontations with armed soldiers?
Why use young boys as cannon fodder?
If Israel is in the right would not Israeli soldiers be justified under the circumstances in defending themselves and their country by live fire?
An army is a fighting machine. It stands between the life and death of a nation.
For an army to functions its soldiers cannot allow themselves to be fired at or have projectiles slung at them and not react.
I was once hit by a stone fired by an Arab from a slingshot and know what it is like to be on the receiving end.
Restraint is not always a virtue.
The MAJOR QUESTION should concern the rights and wrongs of the conflict.

To my mind the "Wall" should not have been necessary but since the Israeli Government is constricted by its own outlook, public opinion, and international pressures there may have been no choice.
The Wall does prevent terrorist attacks and saves Jewish lives and Palestinian ones as well.
Palestinian tradition would normally "allow" the Government to build the Wall where it wished and have individual claims for compensation etc considered later.
This is Palestinian tradition as accepted from Ottoman Empire times and as practiced throughout the Arab world.
Only in Israel are demonstrations, litigation before the building and even after it to reverse it, etc, possible.
Only in Israel does such activity sometimes have an effect on the authorities.
If Israel was less "liberal" incidents like the recent one would not happen.
People who WANT MORE PALESTINIANS AND JEWS TO DIE oppose the State of Israel and encourage the Palestinians to do so.

See also:
The Big Lies
We should face up to the truth.
A Biblical Principal says that someone who tells the truth will recognize it elsewhere.
Let us all make a start in the right direction by at least telling the truth to ourselves.

12. Special Feature:
The War of the Word

Special Feature:
The War of the Word

Selected Edited Minutes from a full-scale no-holds barred debate between Yair Davidiy and a team of anti-Israeli pro-Palestinian pseudo-intellectual fanatics located somewhere in Europe.

In the minutes below Yair Davidiy was debating with about six different adversaries in front of an on-line closed-membership audience that was overwhelmingly against the cause of Israel and the truth which Yair tried to represent.
All the accusations, claims, and attacks on Yair by the six adversaries have been conflated below into one personality termed "Interlocutor". 

(no.11 above) and what we wrote about the alleged Israeli killing of a 9-year old Arab boy]
Wow Yair, you don't bother addressing the point.
Instead you claim it was all a hoax.
Pathetic apologist for a disgusting regime.

I never said it was a hoax.
But if it was it would not change anything.
You would condemn Israel whether it was true or not just as happened with Mohamad Dura.

I might be Pathetic in your eyes and I might be an apologist but between me and you (whoever you are) my position is closer to a just and righteous one whereas you support the powers of hatred and injustice.
Everything is relative and relatively speaking you are relativized by what you relate to in the realm of realty.
Get real!
How many blacks killed in the Sudan today by your Islamic friends?

I Don't care how you are going to sidetrack from this yair but this attack is an absolute disgrace. Armed men that are meant to representing your country have shot and killed a 9 year old child! I hope the brave man that shot this child is pleased with himself, and it is also great to see that you are so deluded that you think it is possible to try and justify it!!

Who says it was an attack?
Soldiers under siege against a horde of screaming demonstrators throwing stones at them, threatening them, and firing projectiles out of slingshots at them.
It was a planned provocation and somebody overreacted to the great delight of the foreign agitators and people like yourself.
Accidents happen.
One may be driving a car and someone jumps in front of it, God forbid.
All your life you may be worried by the incident but who is really culpable here?

You blame his parents on him getting shot dead. Ridiculous.

Not necessarily his parents but the whole network that sacrifices children just to harm Jews.
If you went to New York and threw stones at cops endangering their life etc and the cop shot you it might be reprehensible on the part of the policeman shooting but questions would also be asked about your behavior.

Every person has the right to protest without being shot dead. There is no evidence this child threw anything at the soldiers.

Nine year old children are not to be sent along with a mob of bloodthirsty adults to confront armed soldiers. They are not to be grouped with those older than themselves who are firing dangerous potentially-fatal slingshots at those soldiers no matter who the soldiers are.

Israeli soldiers are not to be treated as punching bags by anyone.
Israeli soldiers defend the people of Israel and thanks to people like you there are less of them than there should be.

Yair, simple question for you. Do you condemn the murder of Mohammed Dura by Israeli soldiers or not?

Maybe you should take a course in reading comprehension?
We have just said that the murder of Mohammed Dura by Israeli soldiers has been proven to not taken place.
Your Arab friends have a saying,
"How do you prove your sister is not a whore when you have no sister?"
How could the Jews prove they did not squeeze blood out of communion hosts when there was no blood in them?
I have a question for you.
If you were to read everything about the case and came to the conviction that the filmed death of Mohammed Dura was indeed a hoax (as proven and now affirmed by a French Court) would you condemn the Ps for staging the incident?
Or would you pass over to the order of the day and continue to condemn the Israelis just as before regardless of what the truth was?

Have you a link for your claims yair?

I can provide you with about fifty links on the subject or you may find them yourself by a simple Google search BUT before that  look at the following video clips (if you have not yet done so) [that were also mentioned above]. They are short and summarize more or less much of the subsequent investigation that mainly serves to confirm them while adding some details and confirmatory evidence.
Palestinians Fake Violence to Trick Media

Al Dura - What Really Happened?

re. Mohamed Dura
You said,
"I can provide you with about fifty links on the subject"
Go ahead, but you wont be able to post one that shows that a French Court claiming this murder of an innocent child by your heroes in the Israeli army was a hoax. Because again yair that is a lie. No french court issued such a judgement.

And I could post fifty links showing that the holocaust never happened. Does that make it true yair?

(a) Mohamed Dura
French Court Confirms: Al-Dura Report Faked

by Nissan Ratzlav-Katz
29 Tammuz 5768, August 1, '08 

(IsraelNN.com) A French appeals court has overturned the libel conviction of Philippe Karsenty, who claimed that the France-2 TV report of the death of Muhammad Al-Dura in 2000 was staged.

Following the French court's decision, handed down Wednesday, Karsenty said France-2 should acknowledge
 that it "created and is continuing to perpetuate the worst anti-Semitic libel of our era."

The case began in 2004, when Karsenty, publisher of a media critique website, claimed that a report aired in September 2000 by France-2 from Netzarim Junction in Gaza purporting to show the killing of a young Arab boy by Israeli soldiers was a staged piece of political theater. The images quickly became a symbol used by Arabs to fan the flames of anti-Israel hatred. The Arab League, meeting in Cairo, went as far as to dedicate October 1 as the Day of Arab Children in honor of Al-Dura. Iran named more than 150 schools after the boy.

In the footage used by the French station in their report, an Arab father and son are shown allegedly hiding from IDF gunfire until there is a cut to the boy lying in the father's lap. At that stage, a voice-over by correspondent Charles Enderlin, who was not on the scene at the time of the filmed incidents, informs viewers that the boy was shot dead by the Israelis.

An official Israeli investigation, as well as subsequent reports in foreign media outlets, showed that it was not physically possible for the Israeli soldiers to have shot the boy. The France-2 news director, in a November 16, 2004 interview with French Radio J, admitted that it is impossible to know with 100% certainty whether the Israelis or the Arabs killed Al-Dura.

In 2004, Karsenty, director of the French website Media Ratings, published an article calling for the resignation of Charles Enderlin and another France-2 employee for staging the Al-Dura boy's death.

France-2 sued Karsenty for libel and won the case in October, 2006. The prosecutor had recommended that the court rule in favor of Karsenty, in light of the evidence he had provided, but the court ruled against him. Enderlin and France-2 were awarded symbolic damages of one euro each, and Karsenty was ordered to pay a small fine and court costs.

Karsenty appealed the decision and, at the outset of his second trial in September, 2007, the French judge ordered France-2 to hand over the raw footage to the court. France-2, however, only made part of the film available to the court. Nonetheless, the court overturned the libel conviction and indicated that Karsenty's claims that the report was phony could not be lightly dismissed.

"The Al-Dura lie is an assault on our ability to think, to criticize, to evaluate, and finally to reject information," Karsenty said Wednesday, "especially the right to reject information on which we base our most cherished assumptions. One of Europe's most cherished assumptions is that Israel is a vicious Nazi-like entity that deliberately murders Palestinian Arab children. Moreover, polls conducted in Europe have identified Israel as the greatest threat to world peace, greater than Iran and North Korea, Pakistan and Syria. The Al-Dura hoax is one of the pillars on which these assumptions rely."

(b) Holocaust Denial.
 The "Interlocutor "
"And I could post fifty links showing that the holocaust never happened. Does that make it true yair?"

True you could and it might well suit you judging by your other posts.
Mahmoud Abbas,  the present "PM" of the Palestinians got a PhD from Moscow for writing a thesis that the Holocaust never happened.
These are the people you identify with.

PA Holocaust Denial
Written and Compiled by Itamar Marcus
The PA lauds Holocaust deniers, and the new PA Prime Minister, Mahmoud Abbas, chose Holocaust denial for his doctoral thesis.

I don't see how human rights protesters and members of the international red cross can be considered "blood thirsty". There is also no evidence anything was thrown at the soldiers?

In the BBC article on the incident there is a photo of a Palestinian firing a sling at Israeli soldiers.
Even if this is a "stock" photo and not actually from the incident itself it portrays the atmosphere the incident took place in.
In the video clip about the boy being shot it concludes with a picture of a slingshot thrower (it is implied from the same village) in action and a promise that the struggle will continue even if it means more little children will be killed.
Real heros, your P people.

A slingshot is not going to kill a heavily armed soldier anyway and poses no threat to them. These people have every right to resist occupation. They are not the ones shooting children. Your soldiers are. I get a bit annoyed when people who support the murder of children try to tell me I'm wrong.

Arab Terrorists (beginning with the PLO) did indeed kill numerous innocent children both Arab and Jewish.
Are you going to tell me now that they did not kill children?
That Arab terrorists do not kill children?
They actually consciously targeted and target children.
Israeli soldiers after extreme provocation might break the law and act in ways that cause death of children but this is exceptional, surreptitious, illegal, and prosecuted against when revealed.
Israeli soldiers will not be made heroes for killing Arab children but P terrorists will be adulated and rewarded for killing Jewish children.
That is a big difference.
Stone can kill and severely injure and have frequently done so.
What is more: Stones are not to be thrown at Israeli soldiers.
Neither are they to be shouted at nor insulted by Arabs or foreign agitators.
Keep your hysterical females at home.
Any Arab who throws a stone at a Jew (soldier or civilian) because he is Jewish
should know that they are in risk of retribution.
That is the truth.

I thought they were protesting against the apartheid wall and were met with severe force from Israeli soldiers, not because the soldiers were Jewish? How do you know all the Israeli soldiers are Jewish? seems like a terrible generalization on your part? They were throwing stones after your soldiers had fired gas at them and rubber bullets!!

None of us knows what really happened.
Nevertheless it should be clear from the video that a group of demonstrators were involved and that they included foreign agitators. It also should be quite clear from the narration that accompanied the video and the picture of a slingshot being fired at soldiers along with the boast that they are ready to sacrifice even more children that more than a passive sit-down "pray-in" type of confrontation was going on. All this can still be seen and heard on the video-clip. They are proud of their "resistance" and boast of what they are doing and also seem to want more of their own killed in order to besmirch Israel.
 I do not believe the 9 year old was targeted although I may be wrong.
It seems more probable however that the boy was with the group that was fired at probably after members of the group having fired projectiles at the soldiers.

The "Wall" exists to keep Arab terrorists away from Jews especially Jewish women and children.
You know that.
If it was not for Arab terrorists killing Jews we would not need a wall.
Jews are killed because they are Jews.
If the Arabs would move elsewhere a wall would not be necessary.
Protests against the wall would not take place if foreign agitators and Jew-haters and Palestinian terrorists were not stirring the natives up to stone and demean Jewish soldiers because they are Jewish.
The Israeli soldiers may also be Druze, Russian Gentiles, or other non-Jews but in the eyes of the Arabs all Israeli soldiers are Jews or in the service of Jews.

You claimed that I had Islamic friends in Sudan killing people.
I have no such friends and do not even know anybody like that. You lied.

You are playing with words.
What I meant was obvious from the context.
I doubt that anyone apart from yourself would have understood it differently.
By "friends" I meant "ideological peers" closely in sync with the Palestinians,
of similar origin as the Palestinians, and sharing the same mentality as the Ps (whom you support) as do most Arabic-speaking Muslims.
Amongst the Muslims "ethnic" distinctions are often unimportant.
They are all part of one Islamic "Uma" or nation.
The Arabic-speaking Muslims in the Sudan also treat non-Muslims and black sedentary non-Arabic speaking Muslims in the same way as the Ps strive to treat the Js.
If you identify with the Ps then by implication you are on the same side as the forces of Islam all over the world that support them and keep their interests before the public eye.

You said:
"Israeli soldiers after extreme provocation might break the law and act in ways that cause death of children but this is exceptional, surreptitious, illegal, and prosecuted against when revealed."
So how many Israeli soldiers and commanders were prosecuted for their war crimes they committed in their most recent illegal invasion of Lebanon?

I do not know.
You tell me.
Israeli soldiers and policeman have on occasion failed to react properly when others and they themselves were in danger because they were afraid of prosecution.
They who brought about such a situation are the ones who should be prosecuted.
Israel fights wars to defend itself against beasts who want to destroy us.
Anyone who takes the sides of these anti-Jewish animals will be punished
and deserves to be punished.

I can only give my opinion of what is in front of me. A soldier shooting a child, I am not going to defend the soldier am I?
The soldier if he had a conscience, I wish he has nightmares every night about what he has done, but there has to be a conscience there in the first place!

In the case of  a gang of very young youths trying to gang rape a little girl and defying a policeman with a gun which side do you choose for?

You are  too busy trying to defend your country rather than looking at the situation in reality and seeing that your country is using it's large military weaponry to ethnically cleanse the Palestinian people.

If by "ethnically cleanse" you mean removing the Ps to somewhere else (and preferably a place better for them) then Israel unfortunately is not doing this but it should be.
Nevertheless keep up the way you are going.
Keep supporting the Ps and encouraging them to defy, trouble, and terrorize the Jews. Maybe such a task is what you are really made for?
Everyone has a purpose in this life.
If you and the rest of the Gentile world keep going the way you are it may be that eventually the Israelis will realize that international opinion will always be against them no matter what.
The Jews will wake up and see that all the world opposes them because the Jews are the Chosen People and believe in the Bible and the others resent it.
Maybe then the Jews will return to their sources, disregard the opinion of groups like your own that hate them anyway, and finally decide to distance the Ps from them by transferring them to a place that is geographically distant.

Sources on Zionism
"Brit-Am Now"-534
#2. Note on HWA and Zionism
"Brit-Am Now"-552
#4. God is a Zionist
"Brit-Am Now"-567
#7. Question on the number 600, 000
"Brit-Am Now"-576
#4. Israeli Zionists Condemned by Amos for Trusting in USA?
Warning to America

#18. Extracts from: The Media's 'Occupation' Myth By David Harsanyi
"Jerusalem News"-416
#4. Dead Sea-Mediterranean or Red Sea Canal?
Brit-Am Now"-725
#3. Is Anti-Zionism really anti-Semitic?
Brit-Am Now"-805
#2. Jews Against Zionism??
Jerusalem News-20(a)
#3. GUEST COLUMN: How the British fought terror in Jenin
Jerusalem News-69
#3. Israel has 400 nukes
Jerusalem News-129
#2. More equality [for Arabs] in Israel than in Europe
Jerusalem News-215
#3. Some Statistics About Israel
Jerusalem News-220
#5. Religious Zionists
Jerusalem News-226
#1. Arabs Claim: Israel's nuclear power vital for USA.
Jerusalem News-245
#1. Druze
#2. Who Are The Druze?
Jerusalem News-250
#2. Abortions by Binyamin Zeev Kahana
#3. Efrat
Jerusalem News-256
#2. Israeli Technology
Jerusalem News-270
Jerusalem News-(284)285
#2. Napoleon was the first Zionist: Book
Jerusalem News-358
#6. Arutz Sheva URLs Worth Viewing
Senior Border Police Officer Quits Over Evacuation
MK Kara Says Druze Soldiers Should Not Implement Disengagement
Jerusalem News-372
#3. The Drums of War
Jerusalem News-380
#2. Mostly Veteran Front-Line Soldiers Refused to Expel Fellow Jews.
3. Interesting Map of Judah and Samaria
Jerusalem News-392
#5. Brit-Am Contributes to Israel's Tourism Effort
Photos of Shiloh and Mount Hermon
Jerusalem News-400
#3. Israeli Patriotism: Statistics
Jerusalem News-407
#5. Prof. Paul Eidelberg: "The Myth of Israel's Dependence on the United States"

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