R1b: The Western Japhet?? or not?



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R1b Haplogroup

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Brit-Am Answers to Queries: DNA.

1. Introduction
2. R1b in Ireland
3. R1b in the East: Armenia
4. R1b Links to Dead Sea Area in Jordan?
5. R1b in the East and Amongst the Jews


1. Introduction
This is roughly what is said about R1b:

First there was A, a descendant of A left Africa
and experienced mutational changes until becoming super-haplogroup
K. From K emerged the first R (defined by the mutation M173),
 "most of his lineal descendants died off (there still being some M173 in the Dead Sea region of the Middle East and the Camaroons in Africa)".
From R emerged haplogroup R1b1c(mutation M269)  "the direct ancestor in the male line to a majority of men in many parts of Northwestern Europe [and the Iberian Peninsula], but still leave a small group of descendants as in the Middle East (e.g., Syria)."
  About 40% or more of the European Y chromosomes today are R1b.
<<These ... R1b chromosomes reach a veritable saturation point in the western counties of Ireland (98.5%) and parts of Spain (e.g., the Basque Region) where the numbers are close to or above 90%. R1b declines in frequency from Ireland and Iberia to Eastern Europe where it is scarce. It is still found in West, Central and South Asia, but much more rarely.>>

<<[R1b] ... is found all over the world today as a legacy of colonialism, to cite just four examples it is found at appreciable frequencies amongst Pacific Islanders, Eskimos (Inuit), Latin Americans/Hispanics and African Americans.>>
A variation is also strong in Turkey.

Source for information and quotations concerning R1b
EthnoAncestry: "Unlocking Your DNA Archive"

An Early Asian Homeland: The available data suggests that from the Zagros Mountains in southwest Asia, the males who were to destined to be patriarchs to essentially all modern Europeans and Central Asians were accumulating new mutations including a male with marker M9 who’s descendants are known as super-haplogroup K, and his descendant with M45 who gave rise to all the Q and R haplogroups. The ancestor carrying the M45 marker became the progenitor of a man with a letter change at M173. Although most of his lineal descendants died off (there still being some M173 in the Dead Sea region of the Middle East and the Camaroons in Africa), this one individual would ultimately have a descendant with a mutation at M269 (haplogroup R1b1c) who was a true patriarch, becoming the direct ancestor in the male line to a majority of men in many parts of Northwestern Europe, but still leave a small group of descendants as in the Middle East (e.g., Syria). Furthermore the M173 ancestor also gave rise to M17 (haplogroup R1a1) who was to populate Central Asia and Eastern Europe where in many locations between Mongolia and Poland this haplogroup is found in over half of the males. Meanwhile other M45 descendants became the progenitors of haplogroups P*, Q*, and Q3 of Asia and the Americas.

See also:
R1b at Dead Sea region in Jordan

World and Europe Haplogroup Maps

2. R1b in Ireland
Y-chromosome variation and Irish origins
Emmeline W. Hill, Mark A. Jobling, Daniel G. Bradley
NATURE' VOL 404 23 MARCH 20001

...significant differences in genetic frequency between those of Irish Gaelic and of foreign origin, and also between those of eastern and western Irish origin. ..
Surnames have been used in Ireland from about AD 950 as markers of complex local kinship systems. As both surnames and Y chromosomes are paternally inherited, we divided our Irish sample into seven surname cohorts for which ancient geographical information is known, with some error. Four are of prehistoric, Gaelic origin (Ulster, Munster, Leinster and Connaught) and three are diagnostic of historical influx (Scottish, Norman/Norse and English).
Surname subdivision reveals a cline in Irish samples, with exogenous samples clearly showing lower frequencies (English, 62.5%; Scottish, 52.9%; Norman/Norse, 83.0%) than Gaelic Irish samples (Leinster, 73.3%; Ulster, 81.1%; Munster, 94.6%), which almost reach fixation in the western-most province (Connaught, 98.3%). These highly significant differences in the frequency of hg 1 [R1b] between Irish Gaelic and non-Gaelic Y chromosomes (12<0.001) and between eastern and western Gaelic Y chromosomes (P< 0.001) persist when duplicated surnames are removed.
..we estimated that hg 1 frequencies follow a cline within Europe, extending from the Near East (1.8% in Turkey) to a peak in the Spanish Basque country (89% ...). This cline mirrors other genetic gradients in Europe and is best explained by the migration of Neolithic farmers from the Near East. When the surname-divided Irish data are appended to this cline, it continues to the western edge of Europe, with hg 1 the putative pre-Neolithic western European variant reaching its highest frequency in Connaught (98.3%).
In a maximum-parsimony phylogenetic analysis of both bialellic and simple tandem-repeat (STR) variation between Irish Gaelic haplotypes .., the hg 1 chromosomes cluster together tightly, with the highest-frequency haplotypes occupying central positions, suggesting a coherent common ancestry. The smaller number of
non-hg 1 haplotypes shows no such coherence, consistent with their being immigrants. Their concentration in the eastern Gaelic cohorts may be indicative of a pre-historic influx or of later gene flow across the linguistic barrier from historical migrant groups.
[This means roughly that R1b [hg1] variations cluster around a central type and visibly deviate from that type whereas variations from the other known haplogroups in Ireland are much more dispersed as if they moved in as individual breakaways from several other groupings beyond Ireland].
These findings suggest that hg 1 is the earlier, indigenous Irish variant.

Comprehensive Chart R1b Varieties
shows R1b Modal haplotypes
as well as a few select R1a Modal haplotypes: English, German, Slovenian, Polish, and other varieties,
The chart was prepared by Ken Nordtvedt who provides an even more comprehensive services for ["http://www.northwestanalysis.net/"] haplogroup I
R1b varieties defined on the above chart include:
Irish: R1b-AMH, R1b-N-Ir, R1b-Ir3, R1b-S-Ir , R1b-Ir/Cont
R1b-Sc, R1b-Sc2,
Norwegian: R1b-Nor
Frissian: R1b-Fris
R1b-F3, R1b-F2, R1b-F2*, R1b-F2**, R1b-F4,
R1b-Ub ,
East European: R1b-E-Eur
R1b-East1,R1b-East2, R1b-NE
3. R1b in the East: Armenia
"Today, in Western Ireland, R1b Y-DNA can be found in almost 100% of all males. However the R1b haplotype gradually declines as one moves east from Ireland toward Scandinavia to Eastern Europe where it virtually disappears beyond the Middle East. The vast majority of Northern Europeans are R1b3, defined by marker M269+. The R1b haplotype (a set of marker scores indicative of the haplogroup) is very difficult to interpret because the R1b markers are found at relatively high frequency where the Anglo-Saxon and Danish invaders originally called home. (e.g., 55% in Friesland) and even up to 30% in Norway."
01-16-2006, 02:58 AM
Armenian modal haplotype
The most frequent haplotype in a sample of Armenians was seen against the background of HG1 Y chromosomes. It occurred in all Armenian groups, at frequencies ~5-14%. According to YHRD, the same haplotype defined over more loci (14 13 29 24 11 13 12 11,14) was also the most frequent one, occurring in 3% of Armenians (*). According to Whit Athey's haplogroup predictor, this is suggestive of haplogroup R1b.
The geographical distribution of this haplotype is such that it is shared by Armenians and two other populations from the Caucasus. Moreover, it is lacking in most other populations from the Caucasus, as well as in the other populations from further east. On the other hand, it is more frequently found in Europe, where as we know, haplogroup R1b tends to have higher frequencies as well.

The Armenian modal haplotype is also the modal R1b3 haplotype observed by Cinnioglu in Anatolia. According to him, apparently it entered Anatolia from Europe in Paleolithic times, and diffused again from Anatolia in the Late Upper Paleolithic.

4. R1b Links to Dead Sea Area in Jordan?
Isolates in a corridor of migrations: a high-resolution analysis of Y-chromosome variation in Jordan

A high-resolution, Y-chromosome analysis using 46 binary markers has been carried out in two Jordan populations, one from the metropolitan area of Amman and the other from the Dead Sea, an area geographically isolated. Comparisons with neighboring populations showed that whereas the sample from Amman did not significantly differ from their Levantine neighbors, the Dead Sea sample clearly behaved as a genetic outlier in the region. Its high R1*-M173 frequency (40%) has until now only been found in northern Cameroonian samples. This contrasts with the comparatively low presence of J representatives (9%), which is the modal clade in Middle Eastern populations, including Amman. The Dead Sea sample also showed a high presence of E3b3a-M34 lineages (31%), which is only comparable to that found in Ethiopians. Although ancient and recent ties with sub-Saharan and eastern Africans cannot be discarded, it seems that isolation, strong drift, and/or founder effects are responsible for the anomalous Y-chromosome pool of this population. These results demonstrate that, at a fine scale, the smooth, continental clines detected for several Y-chromosome markers are often disrupted by genetically divergent populations.
5. R1b in the East and Amongst the Jews
From: News Writing <newswriting@>
Subject: R1b and H mtDNA
To: britam@netvision.net.il

Hi. Regarding R1b Y chromo and H mtDNA, these types are found all over Syria. They were in the Jewish population long before there was a religion and in the common ancestor around 7,800 years ago. R1b is also one of the Armenian Y chromo types as well as found in people of the N. Mesopotamian era and also found in Assyrians. The R1b has been in Europe for 40,000 years with the Aurignacian culture and came from the Arabian Gulf/Syria and Zagros mountains area long before there was any religion. R1a1 also makes up 10% of Syria. Hammer has figures in his articles on R1a1 making up 10 percent of Syrian men. I've seen R1b in Syrians and also they appear on the R1b printout from Family Tree.

I lived in a neighborhood of Jews from Aleppo. So if you compare their Y chromo with Jews from Poland,  you'll see plenty of R1b and R1a1 in both. Hope this helps. The R1b/R1b1 and R1a/R1a1 Y Chromosomes are found all over the Middle East and also all over Europe. What separates R1a is that they came from Central Asia/Ukraine 33,000 years ago to Europe. R1b1 came to Europe 40,000 years ago. Both are found today in the Middle East and have been there and in Europe for thousands of years.

You can check out the Neolithic types from Jericho. You'll find all these types there and in Europe showing up 9,000 years ago...before modern religions.  Hope this Helps.

Anne Hart, M.A.
author of books on DNA

Ellen Levy-Coffman: R1b amongst Ashkenazic Jews
"According to the findings of Behar (2004b, Supplementary Material), R1b comprises 44 out of 442 results, or nearly 10% of Ashkenazi results. Additionally, Behar (2004b) reports that the highly-admixed Dutch Jews have 26.1% R1b results. Haplogroup I (I-P19) comprises 18 out of 442 results, or approximately 4% of the Ashkenazi results. Thus, haplogroups R1b and I among Ashkenazi Jews comprise almost 15% of the DNA results." See also:

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