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Brit-Am Now no. 1558
The Lost Ten Tribes of Israel Movement


17 August 2010, 7 Elul 5770
Contents:
1. Welcome to Brit-Am Now!
2. Time for  Joseph to Come Home?
3. Reply to Questions from Joseph Lowe.
Western Israelite nations and Christianity, Messiah son of Joseph and the Christian Messiah,
What Needs to be Done, The Return of Joseph and the Ten Tribes


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1. Welcome to Brit-Am Now!

Brit-Am Now is a regular e-mail posting of the Brit-Am Ten Tribes Movement that has traced the Lost Tribes of Israel to Western Nations.
http://www.britam.org/
For reasons we would rather not enumerate we recently suffered a serious loss of information. Many recent letters and postings in preparation etc disappeared.
Also our up-to-date e-mail address listings are gone.
This present posting is going out to a reconstructored list: Some of you may have been subscribed in the past and then asked to be unsubscribed; others may never have been subscribed but merely have sent us orders etc.
Those who wish to UNSUBSCRIBE should send an e-mail to yair davidiy <britam@netvision.net.il> with UNSUBSCRIBE in the subject line. Nothing more is needed.

Brit-Am Now is a positive and worthwhile service.
We offer regular informational and research updates, new insights, letters from our readers and observations from them, answers to queries, topical disputes, etc.
For examples of recent Brit-Am Now Postings see:
http://www.britam.org/NowContents6.html

Together with Brit-Am Now Postings we also send out notices of new articles and new postings on our sister update services in the fields of History, Biblical Studies,  DNA, etc.
Details may be seen at:
http://www.britam.org/contentsContemporary.html



2. Time for  Joseph to Come Home?
Re: testW
Received....is it time for Joseph to pack up and come home?
Avigdor
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Brit-Am Reply:
Joseph includes a great multitude.
They too need to be informed of their origins.



3. Reply to Questions from Joseph Lowe.
Western Israelite nations and Christianity, Messiah son of Joseph and the Christian Messiah,
What Needs to be Done, The Return of Joseph and the Ten Tribes
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Joseph Lowe wrote:
 

I have gone over your site and continue to do more so as is a lot of info.

I have several questions for you.

1. You seem to say western nations have roots in the lost tribes. Do  you recognize that the western nations are well christian nations?

2. Do you believe the christian nation then is the House of Joseph and  each country it occupies falls under a tribe?

3. You are a jew and so am I, I understand you are not a christian in  beliefs either correct? So with that, there is a part of your site  that you say a saviour/messiah will be born from Beit Yosef (which I  know is oral tradition from the sages) that will lead the scattered  tribes which you believe are the western nations which are primarily  or have been for the majority christian nations. Is this message  saying that [the Christian Messiah] you believe is the messiah of the scattered tribes  as the western nations believe? They do believe he is their leader.

4. How are we to differentiate the goy from the goy that are scattered  israelites without their identity? Or do we cleanse the christian  nation back into the covenant and torah?

5. Are we to then immigrate the billion plus hidden israelites to  israel and divide the lots as torah states or wait for moshiach?

Thanks

Joseph Lowe
Metro Surety Group

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Brit-Am Replies:

(1. Are All Christians Israelites?

Nations identified by the Brit-Am Movement of the Ten Tribes as Israelite are all Christian but not all Christians are Israelite.
European Christian Nations as a whole are associated with Edom.
Joseph (i.e. the Ten Tribes) co-exists alongside Edom, was subject to Edom (Amos 1:6,9), and eventually will war against him (Obadiah 1:18)
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(2. Can Every Christian Nations Be Equated with an Israelite Tribe?

I did not properly understand this question. Each Israelite Tribe may more or less be allocated to a specific European Nation in the West.
Details are given in our work "The Tribes".
http://britam.org/the-Tribes.html
These nations are all at least nominally Christian but they comprise only a minority of the Christian Nations.
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(3. Is the Messiah Son of Joseph the Christian  Messiah?

Quite a few Christians equate the projected Messiah son of Joseph with the Christian Messiah. The concept of the Messiah son of Joseph is mentioned very briefly Early Aramaic Translations, in collections of obscure Midrashim of uncertain origin, apparently also in some pseudo-Apocryphal works (see Raphael Patai), in a few lines in the Talmud, in brief references by commentators such as Saadia Gaon and Abraham Ibin Ezra, etc.
Some [pethaps questionable?] sources say the Messiah son of Joseph will be killed and then resurrected and that he suffers for all Israel.
[This is obviously parallel to similar concepts in Christianity.]
The concept may [or may not] have existed before Christianity and have derived from trends of thought that influenced early Christianity and perhaps were also influenced by it.
Despite the antiquity of this concept, the idea does not seem to have been related to seriously in Judaism until recently.

In our time amongst Religious Zionists and others, the Messiah son of Joseph is also taken to represent an historical phenomenon of Israelites returning to their Land i.e. Zionism.
A lot has been written on this matter.
I personally do not take any of these sources literally or seriously since their reliance on Biblical Passages is too tenuous.
The Sages also do not expound on this matter.
What interests Brit-Am is the aspect of Biblical Exegesis in which Messiah son of Joseph is the future leader of the Ten Tribes when they return and even before their return may be considered a king of allegory concerning the Ten Tribes and symbolizing them. This helps us understand certain Biblical Passages concerning the Ten Tribes in general and strengthens our own interpretation of the verses under consideration as pertaining to the Ten Tribes.

You asked,
# Is this message saying that [the Christian Messiah] you believe is the messiah of the scattered tribes 
as the western nations believe? #

We do not believe in the Christian Messiah. We are not interested in the matter.

Jews are OBLIGATED to remain Jewish and to strengthen themselves in their Jewish Beliefs.
There can be no compromise on this issue and it is an extremely important point.
Jews are OBLIGATED MOST SEVERELY to keep the Torah and obey the commandments. This is their life and that of their children. The whole world depends upon this. Anything that seeks to diminish this obligation is bad and must be condemned .

Our task is NOT to engage in  inter-faith dialogue. We resent attempts to use us or manoeuvre us into theological considerations that are alien to our direct fields of interest.
We have a message to promote that is IMPORTANT and that is for the good of the people we are directing it towards.
People who hurt us damage the cause of all Israel.
The Brit-Am Movement of the Ten Tribes works for the good of all Israel.
We believe in the Hebrew Bible and that is all.
For more concerning the Brit-Am understanding of the Role of Christianity, See:
Notsrim
http://www.britam.org/Proof/Attributes/roleNotsrim.html
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(4. What Should Ephraimites do for their Israelite Identity?

We cannot tell you what needs to be done next on the religious plane.
We need to emphasize the Ten Tribes are not Jews or a collection of something-like the Jews but rather a collectivity in their own right.
They themselves need to realize that the message is saying that as a group they are descended from Israel.
They will mostly return as a group i.e. be re-united with Judah but how and when this will happen is not known.
All we know at present is their identity and that only in very general terms that need to be confirmed and asserted.
At present,
The identity of the Ten Tribes NEEDS to be made known through more research, making the research results known,
and causing the authorities (i.e. history experts etc) to take the results seriously.
This to our minds is the FIRST step.

By allegory,
Someone approaches you in the street and out of the blue convinces you that you may well be a co-inheritor to a vast fortune.
He convinces you but you see that the evidence (though strong) is not of a nature acceptable to others.
Further research along the lines already initiated could however lead to definite proof of the kind required.
The inheritance entails not only benefits but also difficult obligations which to fulfill could require the acquiescence of quite a few other co-inheritors.
People (in this case the Brit-Am Movement of the Ten Tribes) are working on your behalf and they want you to help them, take an interest in the issue,  and work with them. The choice is yours. It is true that you have no clear-cut definite obligation regarding this subject.
On the other hand Divine Providence must have opened your eyes up to thew matter for a reason.
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5. What will the Future Bring?
Will all the Tribes return to an enlarged rehabilitated ecologically altered Greater Land of Israel stretching from the Nile to the Euphrates and beyond?
Or will only a portion return?
What will happen to the others? Will they remain were they are?
How many of them (i.e. of us) are there really?
When will this happen?
How will it come about?
These and other questions are referred to in Scripture. Different possibilities seem to be raised.
We have discussed this in our Brit-Am Biblical Commentaries.
http://www.britam.org/ContentsSubject.html#lic
Some of our correspondents have also suggested various scenarios based on their own understandings of Scripture.
We in Brit-Am encourage discussions and studies of the Bible and anything that enhances Biblical understanding.
We concentrate however especially on matter involving the Israelite Ancestry of Western Peoples.




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