Debate: "Will All the Israelites Will Come Back?"

Completeness of Resettlement in the End Times?


Debate Deriving from the Article,
"All the Israelites Will Come Back!"
Completeness of Resettlement in the End Times."
http://www.britam.org/Complete.html
by Alexander Zephyr


Contents:
1. Previous Remarks of Relevance.
2. Only a Remnant Will Return! by Bruce McKerras
3. Alex Zephyr: Jeremiah 3:14 Proves Completion of Return, Not the Opposite!
4. Alex Zephyr: Gentiles (not Israelites) will be going up to Pay Homage!!
5. Alex Zephyr: Those Who Are Destroyed Will have been left Behind!
6. Abraham (Rudy) Rempel: Even a Portion Out of Many is a Lot!
7. Interim Conclusion to Debate by Brit-Am Adjudicator.


Remarks of Relevance:

#4. If all the Lost Ten Tribes Return to the Land of Israel will there be Enough Room for them?
http://britam.org/Questions/QuesReturntoLand.html

Brit-Am Now no. 1679.
#1. Jeff Booth: Only a "Residue" of Israelites will Return!

#4. Will the Land of Israel Encompass North America?


2. Only a Remnant Will Return!
by Bruce McKerras
Only a remnant will return. Several Bible passages state this, however, if you consider the population of the Western nations, then that could be a considerable number. Even 1% would be several million.
Zechariah 10:8-10 I shall whistle to call them in.....they will be as many as they used to be....though in far off lands......I will gather them....until there is no more room for them.
Jeremiah 31:8 See how I bring them home from a northern land, from the far ends of the earth.....a vast company.
Isaiah 49:20 Children born during your bereavement [the dispersion] will say; make room, this place is too cramped.
 
Then we are told that the Land will be much bigger than it is now;
Micah 7:11 .....that will be a Day when your boundaries will be extended.
Obadiah 19-21 My people will possess.....Eretz Israel.
 
Bruce McKerras


3. Alex Zephyr: Jeremiah 3:14 Proves Completion of Return, Not the Opposite!

Hello Yair,
I would like to make a short response to a comment of one of your readers, Jeff Booth, in Brit-Am 1678.
#1. Jeff Booth: Only a "Residue" of Israelites will Return!
http://britam.org/now2/1679Now.html#Jeff
He wrote: "During the Millenium only a small percentage of Israelites actually return to Canaan."
He derives this conclusion from the verse Jeremiah 3:14 which says:
"I will take you one of a city, and two and two of a family."
It is absolutely not clear how this verse contribute to the conviction that not all Israelites will return to the Holy Land?
The wordings of this verse do not indicate that selection will have taken place among the Jewish or Israelite populations.
One of the best translators and commentators of the Bible, Rabbi David Kimchi (1160-1235, Portugal), explained this verse in this way:
"Though there may be but one Jew in a city of the Gentiles, or two only in a nation ("family" in the Scripture connote country or nation), the Lord will take them from thence."
The context of the whole of Chapter 3 of Jeremiah does not speak of selection:
"Return, faithless sons; I will cure your backsliding. I will restore you to health and heal your wounds.
Yes, we will come to You, for You are the Lord our God."--
This is the main theme of the Chapter.
Conclusion: Jeremiah 3:14 is an additional proof confirming that all Israelites and Jews will return to the Promised Land! (Amos 9:9; Ezekiel 39:28; 36:10).


4. Alex Zephyr: Gentiles (not Israelites) will be going up to Pay Homage!!

Re Brit-Am 1678.
#1. Jeff Booth: Only a "Residue" of Israelites will Return!
http://britam.org/now2/1679Now.html#Jeff
Jeff Booth referred to  Zechariah 14:16 as a proof that the "majority of Israelites will remain in their Appointed Places throughout the Millenium and go year-to-year to pay homage to their Messiah."

Zechariah 14:
16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.

Again, Jeff somehow forgot that the nations who go year-to year to Jerusalem to warship the Lord (not the Messiah!) are not the Israelite nations! These kind of "tricks" do not give a good impression about the author and nullifies his argumentation.
The Prophet specifically said he was referring to "every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem."
In Ezekiel 38 and 39 and Zechariah 12 and 14 these events are clearly described in detail. Even the names of the nations are given! (Ez.38:2, 5, 6).  Jeff should have known that during the Wars of Gog and Magog  the Jews and Israelites will have been reunited and dwell in their Ancient Land restored to its Biblical borders.
They will live in the Promised Land in peace and security, all of them (Ezekiel 38:8, 11).
The attack of Gog will have been aimed against the whole house of Israel. It is very obvious that the nations mentioned in Zechariah 14:16 are not those of Israelite origin and will have had have nothing in common with them.


5. Alex Zephyr: Those Who Are Destroyed Will have been left Behind!

Re Brit-Am 1678.
#1. Jeff Booth: Only a "Residue" of Israelites will Return!
http://britam.org/now2/1679Now.html#Jeff
The last verse Jeff Booth refers to in proof of his thesis that not all Israelites will return is Isaiah 10:22:
"For though thy people Israel be as sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return."

I have to partially agree with Jeff on this. Here is what I wrote in a soon-to-be-published work:

"Will all the Israelite have survived the calamities of the wrath of the Lord?
We do not think so.
Many of the house of Jacob will have perished. Those who forsake the Lord and His Holy Land; Who worshiped the idols from wood and stone, the gods which can not save; those who rejected the calls of God and perpetually did evil, will be requited.
"Therefore will I number you to the sword, and you shall all bow down to the slaughter" (Isaiah 65:12).
"Destruction has been decreed overwhelming and righteous" (Isaiah 19:22).

The Scripture even gives the proportion of those who will have perished:
"And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein" (Zechariah 13:8).

There are speculations that this applied to the Jewish people during the Roman-Jewish wars, when 2/3 of their population was slaughtered and/or died from starvation and plagues.

Regardless of this, no matter how much in numbers the whole house of Israel may be (we presume that they will still be in the hundred of millions) all of them will have been ingathered to the Promised Land.
God will have left none of them there any more. Not one member of an Israelite family will be left behind in the countries of their exile!


6. Abraham (Rudy) Rempel: Even a Portion Out of Many is a Lot!

Shalom Yair,

I would like to add to the discussion of how many Israelites will be returning to their ancient homeland.

The issue seems to conflict between, only a remnant returning, and, that the land will not be able hold them because there will be so many. The problem is easily resolved. By that time, the seed of Abraham will surely be as the sand of the sea and the stars of the heavens. So even though only a remnant will return, the actual number will be very, very high.

Abraham (Rudy) Rempel.


7. Interim Conclusion to Debate by Brit-Am Adjudicator.

The subject matter of this knew controversy does not directly involve Brit-Am teachings one way or the other.
We are therefore even more open and impartial than our usual profound sense of fair play and impeccable integrity inclines us to be anyway.
If anything we would incline towards a solution that leaves the options open BUT such has not yet come up.

Alex Zephyr so far is well ahead in this discussion.

The simple meaning of the Biblical Script is on his side.
His opponents are obviously scholars and well-versed in the Bible. Their arguments however rely on implicit suggestions and not on outright declaration.
They in effect use Midrashic-type arguments without having Rabbinical Tradition or thorough knowledge of the Hebrew language behind them.
[This does not mean they are wrong but it is still worth noting.]
Alex Zephyr has countered all arguments given and has quoted verses that expressly say the same as he.
See:
All the Israelites Will Come Back!
Completeness of Resettlement in the End Times?
by Alexander Zephyr
 http://www.britam.org/Complete.html

# 'Then shall they know that I am the Lord their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own Land, and have left none of them any more there #(Ezekiel 39:28).
We looked up a few Commentaries on this verse (Ezekiel 39:28):

Rashi: Not one will be left in Exile.

Daat Sofrim: This is the most explicit promise concerning the ingathering of all the Outcast of Israel.

A compromise such as we suggested might be feasible.
We suggested:
#4. Will the Land of Israel Encompass North America?
 http://www.britam.org/Questions/QuesLand.html#Will
We said:
# It may be that after that the sanctity of the Land of Israel will be expanded to include all Lands in which the Ten Tribes are to be found? #
Even this however is unclear. It requires too much reliance on Rabbinical Traditions to be countenanced by non-Jewish savants.







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